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Author Topic: Suggestions to lessen spam accounts  (Read 138 times)
Silent26
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August 10, 2018, 09:25:03 AM
 #1

There has been a lot of Newbies and Brand new accounts that is recently created and more accounts are being generated ever day (including bot accounts), the bad news is, these accounts are just being used for spamming the Forum. If we will just try to look at the situation, spammers are almost taking over the Forum. So, here's my stupid idea that might make you say "Hmm interesting" or "it's really stupid".

Please take note that these ideas came up to my mind while taking a snack from school Smiley

1. Disabling Registration - A lot of accounts are being created everyday (like what I said) and almost all of these accounts are used only for spamming. I'm just thinking, how if we disable the registration of accounts for a while while we are cleaning the forum from spammers. Here's the pros and cons.

Pros
  • While New accounts/spammers are getting banned, they will not be able to create a new accounts to continue spamming(unless they have another account) and we will continue cleaning the forum from these unnecessary accounts.
  • Accounts used for spamming will be lessen

Cons
  • Those people who will start service, ICO, bounties etc (creating for good purpose) are also won't be able to create account.
  • etc..

Since those people who have good business will be affected, I have some hesitations about this one. Let's move to the other one...

2. Limit account registration per day - How if we put a limit on how many accounts should only be created everyday? For example, only 50 accounts (or less or more than) are available every day. Once the registration limit is reached, the registration will be disabled until the next day.

3. There are designated days when the registration is available - In this one, there are some designated days where a user can create account. For example, the registration is only available every Monday and Friday.

Pros
  • This idea will make spammers wait for some day before they can make account again
  • It will lessen new accounts every.

Cons
  • Those users who are in hurry and really need to create account for some emergency etc. will also need to wait for some day.
  • etc...

4. Putting a designated time where the registration is available - How if there are designated time where users can only create account. For example, the registration is only available every 11:00 Pm to 12:00 Am and 11:00 Am to 12:00 Pm (Forum time). Users must wait until the designated time came before they can make new accounts.


When one (or two) of these idea/s are implemented. The information should appear in the registration page.

This will somehow lessen "spamming accounts" that are being created every day. I just noticed that since the registration is available anytime, users are abusing it. Anyway, there are still a lot of advantages and disadvantages. Let's discuss this idea so that we can be able to figure out more pros and cons.

These are my suggestions, but if you guys will ask me, I really love the 2nd idea combined with either idea 3 or 4 Smiley

Suggestions, questions, opinions, and corrections are open.



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August 10, 2018, 09:43:18 AM
 #2

In other words did you just discouraged me to register with BitcoinTalk?

Imagine I still have not registered yet...

Quote
1. Disabling Registration
So, the door was locked for me

Quote
2. Limit account registration per day
May be I would not bother to recheck when the registration will open for the day.

Quote
3. There are designated days when the registration is available
Again, I would not bother to recheck.

Quote
4. Putting a designated time where the registration is available
Again, I would not have any interest to wait and check back.

I understand that the forum is flooding with people who are making nonsense posts however I do believe there are legit people as well. I would suggest to have a look on my post history. Would you consider me as one of them?

I do not think restricting registration is a good idea. This will bring the forum to a dead end. After all it's a forum, not a must need service that someone need like an exchange service. I have seen Binance or other exchanges were practicing this but you must know that they are exchanges which is a must need for someone who is in the cryptospace. A person can find any information related to bitcoin anywhere on the internet, s/he does not need to wait for the registration to open here and then to register.

I hope it make sense.  Smiley

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August 10, 2018, 09:55:39 AM
 #3

I really don't think this will happen, we don't even have a confirmation e-mail, and you are talking about restrictions.

If you browse a bit trough theymost's post history you will find out that he likes the freedom and any forms of restrictions are not tolerated here.
So proposing suggestions in this direction is just waste of time and effort. I don't think anything will change in the near future.
I suggested the homographs to be forbidden and added to the rules long ago but without any success which was just a tiny little change and I got support from many members here still nothing happen to this very day, so don't expect changes.
I was also enthusiastic like you in the beginning until I understood how the thinks are working here.

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August 10, 2018, 09:58:00 AM
 #4

With all due respect I think these are all terrible suggestions and theymos would never implement these sorts of restrictions. We shouldn't be prohibiting people at all who want to register here. What about about all those users who just need help or more information or want to trade coins or whatever and don't care about signature campaigns? They're all then punished. All this will do is turn away genuine users whereas bots and those looking to exploit it will find a way to do so and will jump through whatever hoops you put in place because there's financial incentive for them. If you want to curb spam then there are numerous better ways. Require a merit requirement to become a Junior. Remove signatures from lower ranks and give them as a reward for when you've earned a certain amount of merit. Allow the purchase of signatures with donator ranks. Punishments for badly run campaigns and those that pay spammers. Those are all very simple measures that can be implemented very easily and don't stop or restrict people from posting here, but they will certainly curb people signing up just to earn money by spamming on badly run campaigns.


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August 10, 2018, 09:59:57 AM
 #5

I think you could probably achieve much the same filtering effect if you had a probation board, and new members were restricted to that. They would have to make an introductory post, and 4 others on that board. Once they hit 5 posts, then the rest of the forum could be open to them. That would give mods a chance to filter the new members.

eMail confirmation would be another good thing. You have to confirm your registration by email when joining Fit to Talk, and that seems to be a great help.

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August 10, 2018, 10:09:14 AM
 #6

I don't want to offend you silent26. I know why do you think this must be done but these are Terrible Ideas IMO. Theymos is totally against "Destructive ideas" which will harm the community in the long run but will deliver short-term results. I agree with "inPRIVACYweBELIEVE", If any one of your suggestions would have been implemented He/She couldn't have registered. Especially in 50 registrations per day. Also, The Bots are literally thousands of times faster than humans, those 50 registrations would still goto bots. I imagine it would become a norm then to buy and sell accounts and these farmers would only Profit more from a system like this.

What came to my mind after reading your thread is to introduce some sort of an application system. Where will new users have to answer some questions about, why they wanna join Bitcointalk? Where did they hear about it? Etc. The Reviewing process can be done by patrollers and moderators alike. But then again Hilariousetc suggestion about shadowbanning newbies till their first approved thread/post serves the purpose just fine.


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August 10, 2018, 10:18:05 AM
 #7

Limiting the number of accounts per day will result in a competition between the bots for creating accounts as soon as the registration opens for that day.

Do not feel surprised, if you see registration being sold here from next day.
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August 10, 2018, 10:20:56 AM
 #8

Just like people above, not good idea.
How about make all newbie only post on some specific board? example newbie only can post on beginner and help section. He have 2 choice for posting outside that section, earn some merit or rank up to jr.member.

   

 
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August 10, 2018, 10:34:20 AM
 #9

What about about all those users who just need help or more information or want to trade coins or whatever and don't care about signature campaigns? They're all then punished.
Actually I knew it will happen that's why I have included this disadvantage.
Quote
Cons
  • Those people who will start service, ICO, bounties etc (creating for good purpose) are also won't be able to create account.
Also the reason why I have hesitations that this would be a great idea. Thanks for the feedback anyway. I'm really satisfied.

I don't want to offend you silent26.
Oh, of course. It's okay Thekool1s. I'm the one who ask for your suggestions and opinions and actually I just tried to share this idea of mine (which is really stupid idea I guess).

In other words did you just discouraged me to register with BitcoinTalk?
By the way, how did I discouraged you? You already have an account but why did you felt discouraged?

Well, I don't have backed up plan to save this idea that's why I think I'm satisfied with all of your answers. I also realised that, yeah we don't even have a confirmation email, I forgot it because I only registered once here in Bitcointalk and didn't notice if there is a confirmation email. Now I remember, it doesn't exist.

Looks like this thread is just another thread to trash. Sorry for being desperate, just wanted to take off those spammers and I don't even realise that I'm becoming selfish.

Anyway, thanks for the replies. Will keep this thread open for up coming "Not agreed" replies and for those who want to keep a discussion about it. Thanks for reading.



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inPRIVACYweBELIEVE
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August 10, 2018, 10:42:00 AM
 #10

By the way, how did I discouraged you? You already have an account but why did you felt discouraged?

I guess you missed it, I said if I was not a member here yet  Smiley

Imagine I still have not registered yet...

I hope it make sense now. I just wanted to give you my feedback in it, did not mean any offense.

Regards,

iPwB

I'm not reclusive at all. Just private. - DeLillo
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August 10, 2018, 10:47:42 AM
 #11

To backup what I said earlier about theymos's post history and freedom I'll post here only two quotes which I think are enough to get you the idea of freedom of the forum and probably the solution to the spammers.

Based on the fact that I now felt that the driving force behind theymos' decisions was not $

Right, I don't care about making money from the forum personally. (I've actually thought about getting rid of the forum ads, since it's often a big headache and the forum has enough reserves for a long time, but operating at a significant loss while there's money basically just sitting on the table feels wrong, even if the level of loss is sustainable for quite a while.)

The things on the forum which encourage spam are allowed mainly because it's part of the forum's mission to be as free as possible. Eg. banning bounties would undoubtedly reduce spam, but that'd be destroying an entire economy/population/culture which has been able to develop due to the forum's freedom. I am willing to take this sort of action, but only as an absolute last resort. It's always preferable to handle these problems by reshaping the environment to make them non-problems, rather than removing some freedom.

It's wonderful when someone is able to constructively do something on the forum instead of continuing with whatever they were expected to do under the status quo. Enabling that sort of thing is exactly why Bitcoin and this forum were created. Though fonstavka.com is not a worldwide welfare organization, and people are not entitled to make money.

Limiting newbie participation is very harmful for a community. Newbie jail will never return: I consider the newbie-jail period to have been extremely damaging to the forum. When barriers to participation are too high, then the best people often just won't go to the trouble of joining, and the people who are willing to jump through the hoops are often people who aren't good for the community: people with nothing better to do, scammers, get-rick-quickers, etc. Having a permanent newbie jail policy would improve things a lot in the short-term, but would end up being a fatal poison to the community.

The low signal-to-noise is a real issue which seriously annoys me and is often on my mind. But as you mention, fixing it non-destructively is difficult.

~
An idea I had in this vein was that upon registration you'd have to pick one of two paths:
 - "I want to discuss things"
     = Banned from all money-making/spam-hotbed sections until Jr Member
 - "I want to make money"
     = Banned from the more serious sections until Jr Member
     = You have to pass a quiz before posting which tries to inform you about basic forum rules, how not to get banned, maybe some basic English knowledge, etc. (Quizzes are pointless to stop dedicated spammers, since an answer key will quickly be compiled, but it may help in cases where clueless people are ending up here.)

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August 10, 2018, 10:49:29 AM
 #12

the current "proxyban" system has done pretty much good job, though it becomes 2 sided bladed
at one side it blocks spammer (evil ip) and on the other side it increases number of unused accounts
you can't really reduce spam accounts by limiting registration time slot and daily cap number
it would just create a new demand and market for non-proxyban newbie account

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August 10, 2018, 02:53:09 PM
 #13

1. Closing registration is unfair for these that do want to post coherent stuff.

2. Limiting account registration per day will mean that the spammers take all the free daily spots before the normal guys.

3. Same, every spammer and their botnets will be lined up to get all the spots while the average normal poster will be left behind.

4. Look at 3)

So that's basically it. There is no easy way to stop spammers, that's the truth. Just look at the twitter case: It's getting filled with bots daily. They try to scam noobs into fake giveaways by posing as famous crypto-related people. I think they are even trying to fake Trump accounts to do it.

Even Elon Musk joined the discussion since they were faking his name too to do giveaways:

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/twitter-scam-elon-musk-cryptocurrency-ethereum-fake-accounts-latest-a8439176.html

Notice that creating accounts in twitter is MUCH harder than creating accounts in here. Twitter has 0 privacy: They have banned tor of course, they have banned every VPN under the sun, they will ALWAYS ask for an SMS verification these days. Yet, botnets with thousands of accounts are created daily. Scammers always find a way.

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August 10, 2018, 08:05:48 PM
 #14

@OP.

If all of your recommendation is taken in effect then  I think we are going to see the account trade of newbie then.

 As there are always few people who visit this forum to ask a question when they are not able to find the solution themselves or outside of this forum. They create an account, ask there questions, get there solution and leave the forum.

What about these people?

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August 10, 2018, 09:01:54 PM
 #15

the current "proxyban" system has done pretty much good job, though it becomes 2 sided bladed
at one side it blocks spammer (evil ip) and on the other side it increases number of unused accounts
you can't really reduce spam accounts by limiting registration time slot and daily cap number
it would just create a new demand and market for non-proxyban newbie account
Wow, I didn't thought that the time will come when even a newbie account will have value if it's clean and if it has successfully passed the registration process...
I've heared that there's a market for high level account, but for newbies...
Restricting lower level accounts from wearing a signature will lower the traffic of the forum as well, so it's not the best idea also...
There's no win-win solution unfortunately...

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